Tracing the Rise of the Ubiquitous "Yes!" and the Rudely Pumped Fist
Bliv bruger af LibraryThing, hvis du vil skrive et indlæg
Dette emne er markeret som "i hvile"—det seneste indlæg er mere end 90 dage gammel. Du kan vække emnet til live ved at poste et indlæg.
But then, the Royal Shakespeare Theatre did a very nice Hamlet in which the frustrated Hamlet tears down a closed circuit television camera, to great dramatic effect.
It's art and communication.
As the past is a foreign country, I suppose prefer historical films to treat it that way, so our horizons may be broadened rather than the present being universalized. In the case of Hamlet, i see no problem because the anachronism is obvious. That is what a play is all about, play. It is the silent rolling up of the carpet I dislike.
jjmcgaffey, thank you! That is very interesting. I understand why the bare chin was thought obscene in Wilde's time, but why would the palm offend? Were the Greeks big slappers! Seriously, anyone?
ok, fogies, i'll try to cut the meladrama.
strawberry, try 1515, it would do you for japanese.
My dad claps and yells "Face!!!" I also clap, rather than punch the air, and yell a variety of things, usually "Score!!!". My brother stampedes across the room. But I can see why someone would punch. In a moment when you're so excited and happy that you need to exclaim, you also need to do something with your hands or body. Waving doesn't seem like a logical thing to do, because a) it suggests you're waving to somebody - do people wave as a solitary gesture? - and b) it doesn't fit the exclamatory nature of the moment.
It comes across to me as quite an aggressive gesture, but maybe that's because NZers are a bit of a sedate lot.
It wouldn't keep me awake at night, but things like that do!
Despite my having won in both group and single athletic events, even in stadiums, it is amazing how little I recall of how exactly I expressed my joy! In one big win at a state meet competing in an event I was embarassed to do, I can recall the loud-speaker blasting “Gill of Geronimo is walking away with the gold!” But, growing up in the 50’s and 60’s, I was able to see a lot of Olympic track and field and recall people hugging one another and running about and waving to others – not so much “to vibrantly express triumph and happiness,” as to graciously share it and acknowledge the cheers. Athletes winning as instant royalty. Think of a Queen (or a President) waving to a crowd.
You make great points about whether waving is a solitary gesture or truly exclamatory? I think we may need to 1) see old movies to be sure about what we did before fists pumping and “yes!” I think I recall a) clapping my hands while jumping up and down and b) saying “yeah!” while looking up, raising the hands with the palms facing up and fingers out. True, it is not exclamatory. c) Outside I am sure I jumped up and down with open hands. It would be interesting to have the opinion of a very close student of baby body language about the nature part of this.
6> jjmcgaffey, I have a question about “Criminals in Greece were paraded through the streets, and the 'proper' way to treat them was to pick up gunk from the gutter and shove it in their faces” – did ancient Greeks all have latex gloves or did they not mind picking up ordure?
Fogies, !Arriba indeed! Using the fist as a signal indicates it was not used ordinarily, doesn’t it? It would be great to get more memories from old GI’s on memories of encountering exotic body languages.
Three new things. the first information, the second a question and the third another of my hyperbolic opinions.
1), the Japanese have a name for thrusting the fist in the air as a triumphant gesture, “gatsu pozu” or “Guts’ pose.” It was invented by and still identified with Guts Takahashi who raised the spirits of Japanese males during the Occupation by beating up on American pro-wrestlers. Other Japanese did not, however, copy it and do the same until it was globalized in the 1980’s.
2) Years ago, I recall seeing a huge photo of a fist sculpture in the Near East. Is, by any chance, fist-raising and punching the air a child of Islam?
3) I recall seeing Michael Jackson’s Beat It! and thinking it looked ridiculous for him to be so aggressively punching into the air trying to look tough. I thought if even the pacifistic elements of Usanian culture have adopted aggressive body language and others copy us, the whole world is screwed. Has anyone anywhere expressed concern over the fist becoming the face of the late-20 and early 21c? And, has anyone noted that while “Yes!” is more formal than “Yeah!” it ends in clenched teeth and a hiss and as such is, like the fist, tense? Has our “body-armor” now covered our hands and our mouths?
The gesture may have been co-opted or taken as cool from them by the wider population as things cooled down or as their statement was accepted.
A history of gestures could be an interesting book. I think a history of this gesture might better make an article.
Note that all of this is guesses. I was told the origin of the insult by a friend in Greece - hearsay at best - and have done no research on the matter.
I find articles generally unsatisfactory unless they are based on a summary of enough research to fill a book. But, still, if anyone can find one, i'd love to see it . . .
And if anyone who regularly gets to a library could get a copy of John Bulwer's Chirologia -- a mid 17c book on gesture including much classical history and i would bet international comparisons because Bulwer is also author of Anthropometamorphosis.
If you want rude, how about the rudely grasped crotch?
ya you're right
(agreeing with you) no duh:)